PS5 PS5 specs revealed today

[gamba66]

The team responsible of the software emulators probably is the same that was working in the emulators for PS4, PSV and PS3
They takes the source code of the previous playstation and "ports" it to the new playstation + improvements and adjustments for the new architecture

But that team probably is splitted in 2 groups, the "experimental" team are the ones that moves sooner to the next playstation (this ones moved from the PS4 to the PS5 more than a couple of years ago), and the others are kept in the previous playstation for manteinance for tasks like:
-bugfixes
-specific code "hacks" hardcoded in the emulators
-backporting new ideas from the experimental team
-etc...

-----------------
If you think in it like a long time project (that lasted since years ago and across different playstation platforms)... is like imposible they are going to throw all that work out of the window
Is just they are either going to announce a high compatibility in a special event for fireworks... or they doesnt have the emulators completly ready

Anyway, i think they are going to implement the software emulators along the PS5 lifetime

I don't doubt they will implement some form of digital BC but I doubt it will be as consumer-friendly as you guys expect.

PSN-Store exclusive only meaning you can't expect to be using your old ps2 collection or any physical media.

Sony only releases a fraction of the games as PS2/PS3 classics and many games are never released due to licensing or emulation issues.

Take GTA Vice Cuty and San Andreas for example where they removed songs from the radio since the license expired.

PS4 had worse ps2 compability than PS3 (non-bc software emu) but atleast it improved perfomance and resolution in some games. Jailbreak is a must of course as an enduser to use this feature on ps3/4 to the full extent possible

My wish would be full BC compability with improved perfomance and resolution. Then I would buy the PS5 on Day One.

 

[sandungas]

I don't doubt they will implement some form of digital BC but I doubt it will be as consumer-friendly as you guys expect.

PSN-Store exclusive only meaning you can't expect to be using your old ps2 collection or any physical media.

Sony only releases a fraction of the games as PS2/PS3 classics and many games are never released due to licensing or emulation issues.

Take GTA Vice Cuty and San Andreas for example where they removed songs from the radio since the license expired.

PS4 had worse ps2 compability then PS3 (non-bc software emu) but atleast it improved perfomance and resolution in some games. Jailbreak is a must of course as enduser use this feature on ps3/4 to the full extent possible

My wish would be full BC compability with improved perfomance and resolution. Then I would buy the PS5 on Day One.

I have doubts too if they are going to do it for "digital content only" (and not real discs), but i bet the PS5 is going to have software emulators
Is mostly because the emulators works in PS4 and "porting" them to PS5 is easy... so is something that already works, sony can have a good money incoming from the store with them

But if they are honest they can do it with real discs because as i said here the technical challengue is pretty much the same
https://www.psx-place.com/threads/ps5-specs-revealed-today.28558/page-2#post-231580


And btw, some months ago there was some rumors about a "remastering engine" (software), that is supposed to add visual improvement features to all the emulators
Technically it makes sense because if all them are software based is posible to join them together as something modular and add some features that could be applyed to all them... things like smoothing, shaders, trophy patches, texture and/or audio swapping, etc...
And from the point of view of marketing is also a good decission because for peope like us in this forum that we are used to play retrogames we dont care about the graphics... or better said we know the kind of graphics we are going to have in a retrogame... but for the medium consumer there are many that downloads a game from PSN and displays it in a 85" 4K TV and are going to be like:
1) look a crash bandicot game in the store for 2€... cool i have good memories of that game... i buy it
2) OMG it looks horrible, that polygons destroyed all my memories :'(

Old games with some graphics improvements in the next gen of TV = aceptable
Old games without improvements displayed in the next gen of TV = maximun eye bleeding

 

[RandQalan]

Hell even games of same step up gen without proper coding has that problem.

 

[Agoni212]

It is very complicated to know who is going to win the next generation because Mark Cerny is like a villain that has plans that even the world doesnt understand.

 

[Md Hesam]

Sony PlayStation's always winner than XBOX

 

[DeViL303]

It does not look great for the Playstation 5 on the surface, but I think all that custom hardware will help. Mark said that would take a lot of load off the main CPU and that might be where they spent some extra money.

• Flash controller will save approx 1 cores worth of cpu power
• Zlib/Kraken decompressor (equivalent to 9 cores?)
• DMA controller (another zen core or 2?)

It might be a case that other bottlenecks like storage I/O will hold the Series X back. idk.

Also we don't know about the xbox reliability, or it's noise levels and prices yet, if the PS5 is €100 to €150 cheaper and a few db quieter then it might work out good.

 

[Agoni212]

It does not look great for the Playstation 5 on the surface, but I think all that custom hardware will help. Mark said that would take a lot of load off the main CPU and that might be where they spent some extra money.

• Flash controller will save approx 1 cores worth of cpu power
• Zlib/Kraken decompressor (equivalent to 9 cores?)
• DMA controller (another zen core or 2?)

It might be a case that other bottlenecks like storage I/O will hold the Series X back. idk.

Also we don't know about the xbox reliability, or it's noise levels and prices yet, if the PS5 is €100 to €150 cheaper and a few db quieter then it might work out good.

Im sure ps5 will be 100€ cheaper than xbox.

 

[Roxanne]

But are pretty much the same, booting the game from a real optical disc inserted in the real disc drive... or booting the game from an ISO (ncluded inside the official PKG)
I mean the technical challengue is the same, the biggest difference is if they wants to support PS1 discs is needed to add a CD compatible laser, but i dont think thats a problem and is not going to increase the manufacturng costs much, sony has been building optical disc drives since tenths of years ago

Spoiler

Also, the optical disc drive that can be seen in the leaked devkit/prototype photos seems to be "low profile"... is different and smaller than the PS4
So it looks they have updated it anyway, probably for good

You know that PS3 Games streamed via PS Now are running on "modified PS3 Server Racks" made by Sony. This is way more easier and cheaper than programming an Emulator, since "Software Development costs money!"

Also the DVD laser supports CD playback as well but it is just not implemented in Orbis OS. Run Linux and it plays fine Audio CDs. Also it is possible to update the System Firmware via CD, so this is not true what you said (check "Notes" --> https://www.psdevwiki.com/ps4/Installation).

It does not look great for the Playstation 5 on the surface, but I think all that custom hardware will help. Mark said that would take a lot of load off the main CPU and that might be where they spent some extra money.

• Flash controller will save approx 1 cores worth of cpu power
• Zlib/Kraken decompressor (equivalent to 9 cores?)
• DMA controller (another zen core or 2?)

It might be a case that other bottlenecks like storage I/O will hold the Series X back. idk.

Also we don't know about the xbox reliability, or it's noise levels and prices yet, if the PS5 is €100 to €150 cheaper and a few db quieter then it might work out good.

For me it looks that if you want to play "3rd Party Games", then it actually doesn't matter which of both you buy. Only if you are really interested to play those "1st Party Exclusives", then time will see if they will really benefit from the "stronger" Hardware (but even if, I bet at the final years of the Console only, like PS4 did, so not before 2027 ).

 

[Agoni212]

You know that PS3 Games streamed via PS Now are running on "modified PS3 Server Racks" made by Sony. This is way more easier and cheaper than programming an Emulator, since "Software Development costs money!"

Also the DVD laser supports CD playback as well but it is just not implemented in Orbis OS. Run Linux and it plays fine Audio CDs. Also it is possible to update the System Firmware via CD, so this is not true what you said (check "Notes" --> https://www.psdevwiki.com/ps4/Installation).




For me it looks that if you want to play "3rd Party Games", then it actually doesn't matter which of both you buy. Only if you are really interested to play those "1st Party Exclusives", then time will see if they will really benefit from the "stronger" Hardware (but even if, I bet at the final years of the Console only, like PS4 did, so not before 2027 ).

People arent realising that ps5 may also have a stronger hardware why im saying this even tho xbox gpu has 12TF and ps5 only 10.3TF ps5 gpu runs on higher frequency which makes the gpu much faster, memory bandwith is higher in ps5, ps5 ssd is much faster than xbox ssd, ps5 is much faster when it comes to speed.

 

[Roxanne]

People arent realising that ps5 may also have a stronger hardware why im saying this even tho xbox gpu has 12TF and ps5 only 10.3TF ps5 gpu runs on higher frequency which makes the gpu much faster, memory bandwith is higher in ps5, ps5 ssd is much faster than xbox ssd, ps5 is much faster when it comes to speed.

It's questionable if all those higher Bandwith will be even in use most of the time, as good explained by Digital Foundry. It doesn't count what's "in name only" !!!

 

[sandungas]

You know that PS3 Games streamed via PS Now are running on "modified PS3 Server Racks" made by Sony. This is way more easier and cheaper than programming an Emulator, since "Software Development costs money!"

Is a long time strategy, not only for the PS5, but for the PS6 and so on, all that emulation of playstation consoles not based in x-86 processor architecture (previous to PS4) needs to be made by software, and they have been pursuing backward compatibility with previous playstation consoles since the PS2
Also as mentioned before one of the biggest selling points of the new XBOX is the backward compatibility

And the servers made with PS3 hardware looks like a waste of money... they could get more profit by doing it with PS5's (or whatever playstation is the latest)

Considering all this i think they was almost forced to take that road

Also the DVD laser supports CD playback as well but it is just not implemented in Orbis OS. Run Linux and it plays fine Audio CDs. Also it is possible to update the System Firmware via CD, so this is not true what you said (check "Notes" --> https://www.psdevwiki.com/ps4/Installation).

So they can support optical discs from all desktop playstations at zero hardware costs

 

[sandungas]

Btw, the "remastering engine" rumored months ago could be a "node" inside the AMD APU... you know in the same way they have announced the PS5 APU is going to have a "node" for the 3D audio maybe they did some magic in colaboration with AMD to support some of the processor instructions of the previous playstations at the APU level
Something like that would be awesome technically... but is just a brainstorming i had while watching mark cerny conference

 

[Agoni212]

PS5 also has the variable frequency feature xbox doesnt have it its an amazing feature and it helps ps5 keep a very good performance and keeps playstation 5 away from heating it is very good for the cooling system.

 

[DeViL303]

Btw, the "remastering engine" rumored months ago could be a "node" inside the AMD APU... you know in the same way they have announced the PS5 APU is going to have a "node" for the 3D audio maybe they did some magic in colaboration with AMD to support some of the processor instructions of the previous playstations at the APU level
Something like that would be awesome technically... but is just a brainstorming i had while watching mark cerny conference

Yeah, maybe they will announce more about that in future. Like "our custom gpu has super duper remastering engine that is the equivalent to 1.9 TFLOPS extra power"

 

[Roxanne]

Is a long time strategy, not only for the PS5, but for the PS6 and so on, all that emulation of playstation consoles not based in x-86 processor architecture (previous to PS4) needs to be made by software, and they have been pursuing backward compatibility with previous playstation consoles since the PS2
Also as mentioned before one of the biggest selling points of the new XBOX is the backward compatibility

And the servers made with PS3 hardware looks like a waste of money... they could get more profit by doing it with PS5's (or whatever playstation is the latest)

Considering all this i think they was almost forced to take that road

So they can support optical discs from all desktop playstations at zero hardware costs

This is true but it is still the question what "new" Games Xbox will deliver. It isn't helpful to emulate two older Xbox Generations when there is still only Halo, Forza and Gears of War. And I also hope that they will add newer 360/Xbox Titles as well. If they stopped this, then I can also buy a cheaper Xbox One.

Yes PS4 reads CD-ROM / CD-R / CD-RW since Day 1. Probably 99% of all DVD lasers reads CDs on whichever Hardware released.

PS5 also has the variable frequency feature xbox doesnt have it its an amazing feature and it helps ps5 keep a very good performance and keeps playstation 5 away from heating it is very good for the cooling system.

This "variable frequency" is just a stupid marketing trick. Every CPU has a variable frequency. Your CPU is less active when you post in this Forum compared when you play a Game for instance. Please don't overhype every 2nd Spec they announce. There know what you want to hear if you know what I mean.

 

[Agoni212]

This is true but it is still the question what "new" Games Xbox will deliver. It isn't helpful to emulate two older Xbox Generations when there is still only Halo, Forza and Gears of War. And I also hope that they will add newer 360/Xbox Titles as well. If they stopped this, then I can also buy a cheaper Xbox One.

Yes PS4 reads CD-ROM / CD-R / CD-RW since Day 1. Probably 99% of all DVD lasers reads CDs on whichever Hardware released.



This "variable frequency" is just a stupid marketing trick. Every CPU has a variable frequency. Your CPU is less active when you post in this Forum compared when you play a Game for instance. Please don't overhype every 2nd Spec they announce. There know what you want to hear if you know what I mean.

I'm not overhyping but thats what it really is and Mark Cerny said it himself what variable frequency is he knows better than me and you because he is one of the key people on creating PS5 he is the lead architect, Xbox doesnt have it if they had they would have said that, both cpu and gpu have variable frequency in ps5 but not in xbox, its real and not a stupid marketing trick you will see it yourself soon.

 

[STLcardsWS]

Looks like more will be revealed on this images as software is talked about . Looks like it at least missing one entry (noticed PS4 text is smaller then PS5 as well)

• PS3 - If there is PS3 support would be in the form of a software emulator, which when covering hardware doubtful there would talk much about that. if its the case.. Will it be disc support or repurchases of games you own. Or PlayStation NOW only
  
• PS2 / PS1 - Optical support via software emulation or digital downloads
• Vita / PSP - Digital downloads (but handhelds are not console's so this is likely not a focus in BC discussions)

Also wondering if that shape has anything to do with the design of console (doubtful but i'll throw it out there nonetheless)

 

[Naked_Snake1995]

View attachment 24833


Looks like more will be revealed on this images as software is talked about . Looks like it at least missing one entry (noticed PS4 text is smaller then PS5 as well)

• PS3 - If there is PS3 support would be in the form of a software emulator, which when covering hardware doubtful there would talk much about that. if its the case.. Will it be disc support or repurchases of games you own. Or PlayStation NOW only
  
• PS2 / PS1 - Optical support via software emulation or digital downloads
• Vita / PSP - Digital downloads (but handhelds are not console's so this is likely not a focus in BC discussions)

Also wondering if that shape has anything to do with the design of console (doubtful but i'll throw it out there nonetheless)

Good eye, although i wouldn't be keen on the gaps between the illustrations used in the presentations, if they truly achieve Backwards Compatibility with all four generations of the PlayStation, mostly the PS1/PS2 and PS4 will be straight from the Optical Media, as expected, and PS3 via Limited Compatibility like the Microsoft did with the 360 Program, which personally I wouldn't mind, I am more interested in the PS1 and PS2 scenario, but we'll have to wait until the box reveal to know the details, but they know if they achieve Backwards Compatibility with all PS Consoles, even if is limited to the most played or popular titles, they'll deal a huge dent in Microsoft's Plans, but realistically i am not seeing it happening anytime soon.

Sent from my G8141 using Tapatalk

 

[Agoni212]

View attachment 24833


Looks like more will be revealed on this images as software is talked about . Looks like it at least missing one entry (noticed PS4 text is smaller then PS5 as well)

• PS3 - If there is PS3 support would be in the form of a software emulator, which when covering hardware doubtful there would talk much about that. if its the case.. Will it be disc support or repurchases of games you own. Or PlayStation NOW only
  
• PS2 / PS1 - Optical support via software emulation or digital downloads
• Vita / PSP - Digital downloads (but handhelds are not console's so this is likely not a focus in BC discussions)

Also wondering if that shape has anything to do with the design of console (doubtful but i'll throw it out there nonetheless)

I think PS5 is going to have full backward compatibility with PS4 even thou Mark Cerny said it will support only 100 games or only some ps4 games, there is still time.

 

[sandungas]

Yeah, maybe they will announce more about that in future. Like "our custom gpu has super duper remastering engine that is the equivalent to 1.9 TFLOPS extra power"

I thought in it when cerny mentioned that the 3D audio is dependant of custom hardware inside the AMD APU
As far i understood the "tempest engine" (awesome name btw) is using a special GPU core to get the positional data directly from inside the GPU, but they have not mentioned if there is something more inside the APU related with audio
You know, like the "video codec" that uses to exists in all APUs to encode and decode video, thats considered a "node" inside the APUs... and the 3D audio could have another "node" (a tiny one though)

And in the same line of thinking... maybe they did something similar for the emulators, something like a "processor translator node" to convert the instructions from the processors of old playstations on real time (and/or other needed hardware component from old playstations)
In that case the emulators would not be 100% software... if they depends of the tempest engine (being hardware) we could say the tempest engine is going to be responsible of 20% of the emulation, and the other 80% would be software

Dunno, but something like that could work... as said it was just a brainstorming i had