PS3 (Research/Experimental) - NEC/TOKIN Capacitors Replacement - YLOD

Workz_777 said:
Hiya, i too was trying with some small size B caps like yours (mine were 470uF - 2.5V), also tried adding some 10uF - 25V MLCCs (see photo) but had no success.

I tried just doing the RSX 1st but still had YLOD, then tried doing the CELL same way as seen in the photo, but no joy. Then i tried without any MLCCs and only had 4 x 470uFs per NEC/Tokin replacement, which was all of them in the end, on both sides, for both RSX & CELL, but still had YLOD.

So i've ordered some size D Panasonic caps in the meantime and desoldered everything. I also have some 470uF 6.3V AVX type around the house that i could try while waiting for the Panasonics to arrive, all being well. I need to replace the bridge wires anyway.

I might have missed the post, but i don't think i have seen a success story using the smaller size B caps yet, seems most / all success stories are with the size D caps. Although it shouldn't make a difference, but maybe there is a tradeoff.

Will aim to update when trying with other caps and larger gauge bridge wires soon, all being well.


View attachment 25665
Click to expand...
can you tell me how much ceramic capacitors to be used and of which capacity and also how to calculate their numbers?
 
Leo07 said:
can you tell me how much ceramic capacitors to be used and of which capacity and also how to calculate their numbers?
Click to expand...

Yes, but that's restricted information.

First you must prove you are worthy to posess that knowlege.

  1. Why do you want to know?
  2. If the answer to 1 is because you are hoping to fix a PS3, then what makes you think caps will help?
  3. Deatils about your console would be helpful too. Like model, SYSCON errorlog, repair history, details about the issue.
 
Gus21 said:
Hello Rip- Felix can you convert this file that is attached to Gerber format? This is Tantalizer (v0.3b)

I already have Tantalizer (v0.6b) in gerber format, and I would like to have tantalizer 0.3b also in gerber format, could you help me with this?

Thanks.
Click to expand...
Yes, I can convert it. But why? If you have v0.6b, just use them.

I don't host files on a public share folder, like google drive or whatever. Haven't looked into it. And this forum only allows uploads of pictures. The only way I can get you the gerbers is by creating another project on OSH park just for you to DL it. Or discord I guess. I'm sure I could figure out how to do it. But it would be just as easy for you to dolwnload KiCAD and convert the files to gerber yourself. Just watch a few youtube videos.
 
RIP-Felix said:
Yes, but that's restricted information.

First you must prove you are worthy to posses that knowledge.

  1. Why do you want to know?
  2. If the answer to 1 is because you are hoping to fix a PS3, then what makes you think caps will help?
  3. Details about your console would be helpful too. Like model, SYSCON errorlog, repair history, details about the issue.
Click to expand...
Sorry for the long Post!... Also i'm new to this scene
--Console model is CECHH-06
--i don't know how to check SYSCON errlog sorry for that, would appreciate if someone tells how to check SYSCON errlog and what tools are required to do so.
--ISSUE is YLOD but it is immediately
--REPAIR HISTORY I've replaced all the Tokin caps with 470uf 6.3v 28 caps and its still immediate YLOD also bridged with a thick wire. that's pretty much it before it was YLOD but 2 secs. now it is immediately haven't checked for a short though... Also Ive a concern about a solder BLOB dropping in MLCC of Cell processor i tried my best to remove all and it looks clean but idk maybe that is the problem but i guess MLCC are non polarized so maybe they wont short but who knows. any tip for repair would be appreciated. Thanks!

OK so i want to know this information because it is not that I'm saying it will fix my YLOD like magic... but because i want to filter all the frequencies that My polymer tantalum capacitors will not filter i.e. if my PS3 revives... as they have high ESR than ceramic capacitors... also I've noted that in PS3 slim and super slims they used this combination of tantalum plus ceramic capacitors to give DC current that is clean ripple free and free from all the unwanted frequencies...
all the electronics are made specifically to be operated at certain conditions and sets of electronic parts are used as to such... so that's why and also i didn't wanted to just go blindly and put any number of ceramic capacitors on board... instead only put that are required to provide the necessary filtering at specified farads.
 
RIP-Felix said:
Yes, I can convert it. But why? If you have v0.6b, just use them.

I don't host files on a public share folder, like google drive or whatever. Haven't looked into it. And this forum only allows uploads of pictures. The only way I can get you the gerbers is by creating another project on OSH park just for you to DL it. Or discord I guess. I'm sure I could figure out how to do it. But it would be just as easy for you to dolwnload KiCAD and convert the files to gerber yourself. Just watch a few youtube videos.
Click to expand...


Hello, yes I already convert.
The tantalizer version (v0.6b) is the best.
On the MLCC they must be 10v or can I put 6v or 25v?
Thanks.
 
RIP-Felix said:
Yes, but that's restricted information.

First you must prove you are worthy to posess that knowlege.

  1. Why do you want to know?
  2. If the answer to 1 is because you are hoping to fix a PS3, then what makes you think caps will help?
  3. Deatils about your console would be helpful too. Like model, SYSCON errorlog, repair history, details about the issue.
Click to expand...

Lol Felix
 
Gus21 said:
Hello, yes I already convert.
The tantalizer version (v0.6b) is the best.
On the MLCC they must be 10v or can I put 6v or 25v?
Thanks.
Click to expand...

Well (imo) v0.3b is the best, it's my favorite of the many versions @RIP-Felix designed. It has more surface area on the sides for soldering to the PS3 board, and it has more GOLD !! Arrrrrrr me hearties!!

Tantalizer 0.3b.jpg



Also @Leo07 ...wow you have been deep reading this thread huh, what a journey it must have been for you. You even quoted one of my first posts on this forum, ahhh those were the days, when we were all sweet and innocent - ripping our poor NEC Tokins off the board for some crappy AVX Tantalums lol :very drunk:
 
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Workz_777 said:
Well (imo) v0.3b is the best, it's my favorite of the many versions @RIP-Felix designed. It has more surface area on the sides for soldering to the PS3 board, and it has more GOLD !! Arrrrrrr me hearties!!

View attachment 37657


Also @Leo07 ...wow you have been deep reading this thread huh, what a journey it must have been for you. You even quoted one of my first posts on this forum, ahhh those were the days, when we were all sweet and innocent - ripping our poor NEC Tokins off the board for some crappy AVX Tantalums lol :very drunk:
Click to expand...
yeah Ive been reading and searching high and low to find out what is actually wrong so reading a lot then found out about ESR ESL ripple free current decoupling their concepts so that's why i asked how to know about the right numbers of Ceramic Caps needed according to need rather than just soldering any number of caps... also had a friend who's electrical engg and he told me that ESR depends on the design of Mobo also that a circuit is designed for a specific specs do if its designed for 4800uf with low ESR each chip then we should try to aim only that not more or less that's what he said... Polymer tantalum caps dont have good ESR value so Ceramics are used to offset what tantalum miss... so i took a peek what sony did with ps3 super slims and the same results as what you did in your old thread only that sony was using what looked to me like 0.1uf ceramic caps...
so judging by your response id say tokin were not to be blamed for YLOD or not every time! id like to share my work too with you once i get chance to do so.
Also @RIP-Felix thank you so much for telling me how to chose right number of Ceramic caps...
 
Leo07 said:
yeah Ive been reading and searching high and low to find out what is actually wrong so reading a lot then found out about ESR ESL ripple free current decoupling their concepts so that's why i asked how to know about the right numbers of Ceramic Caps needed according to need rather than just soldering any number of caps... also had a friend who's electrical engg and he told me that ESR depends on the design of Mobo also that a circuit is designed for a specific specs do if its designed for 4800uf with low ESR each chip then we should try to aim only that not more or less that's what he said... Polymer tantalum caps dont have good ESR value so Ceramics are used to offset what tantalum miss... so i took a peek what sony did with ps3 super slims and the same results as what you did in your old thread only that sony was using what looked to me like 0.1uf ceramic caps...
so judging by your response id say tokin were not to be blamed for YLOD or not every time! id like to share my work too with you once i get chance to do so.
Also @RIP-Felix thank you so much for telling me how to chose right number of Ceramic caps...
Click to expand...

To match as closely as possible the original NEC Tokin Proadlizer (thanks to @RIP-Felix)

If you are replacing 1 x 1000uF NEC Tokin (0E108) Proadlizer:-

3 x 330uF Panasonic Tantalum (2.5v)
1 x (0805) 47uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 22uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 10uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 4.7uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 2.2uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 1.0uF MLCC (10v)
- --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- -

If you are replacing 1 x 1200uF NEC Tokin (0E128) Proadlizer:-

3 x 470uF Panasonic Tantalum (2.5v)
1 x (0805) 47uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 22uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 10uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 4.7uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 2.2uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 1.0uF MLCC (10v)
- --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- -
You could use 3 x 470uF Panasonic Tantalums in both (0E108 and 0E128) if you wanted to, but the 330uF Panasonic Tantalums are much cheaper.

Links for the Panasonics:-

470uF = https://www.lcsc.com/product-detail/Tantalum-Capacitors_PANASONIC-2R5TPE470M7_C147773.html
330uF = https://www.lcsc.com/product-detail...Capacitor_PANASONIC-EEFSX0D331E4_C427165.html

EDIT: But before doing that and spending money only to find out the NECs weren't the problem, it's best to first read your PS3's Syscon Error Logs, which will give you a list of 32 time stamped error codes, each error code can help you identify the real problem. Follow this Syscon Guide (for Windows) by @RIP-Felix ...remember to open all the Spoiler Tabs so you don't miss any important steps.

https://www.psx-place.com/threads/r...s-replacement-ylod.25260/page-192#post-295119
 
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Leo07 said:
yeah Ive been reading and searching high and low to find out what is actually wrong...
Also @RIP-Felix thank you so much for telling me how to chose right number of Ceramic caps...
Click to expand...
Oh, good to hear that you found the links in my signature. I hope they helped you shortcut your research project.

To answer your question (again. New person same question). I use KEMIT's K-Sim to model the frequency response curve of any capacitor combination, to decide what values to best attenuate the frequencies the tokins were better at removing. The MLCCs are not needed, but you can use them if you like.

Here is an example of the frequency response curves:
Tokins vs Array.png
Tantalizer with MLCCs.JPG
Tantalizer only TaPol.JPG

EDIT:
This perhaps shows better what the MLCCs do...
Tantalizer.png
 
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Workz_777 said:
To match as closely as possible the original NEC Tokin Proadlizer (thanks to @RIP-Felix)

If you are replacing 1 x 1000uF NEC Tokin (0E108) Proadlizer:-

3 x 330uF Panasonic Tantalum (2.5v)
1 x (0805) 47uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 22uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 10uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 4.7uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 2.2uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 1.0uF MLCC (10v)
- --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- -

If you are replacing 1 x 1200uF NEC Tokin (0E128) Proadlizer:-

3 x 470uF Panasonic Tantalum (2.5v)
1 x (0805) 47uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 22uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 10uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 4.7uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 2.2uF MLCC (10v)
1 x (0805) 1.0uF MLCC (10v)
- --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- - --- -
You could use 3 x 470uF Panasonic Tantalums in both (0E108 and 0E128) if you wanted to, but the 330uF Panasonic Tantalums are much cheaper.

Links for the Panasonics:-

470uF = https://www.lcsc.com/product-detail/Tantalum-Capacitors_PANASONIC-2R5TPE470M7_C147773.html
330uF = https://www.lcsc.com/product-detail...Capacitor_PANASONIC-EEFSX0D331E4_C427165.html

EDIT: But before doing that and spending money only to find out the NECs weren't the problem, it's best to first read your PS3's Syscon Error Logs, which will give you a list of 32 time stamped error codes, each error code can help you identify the real problem. Follow this Syscon Guide (for Windows) by @RIP-Felix ...remember to open all the Spoiler Tabs so you don't miss any important steps.

https://www.psx-place.com/threads/r...s-replacement-ylod.25260/page-192#post-295119
Click to expand...
Thanks man and @Rip-flex... I'll follow this... But I've already replaced all the tokin caps... Also where can i get tantalizer (if my project is alive by any chance)... once i get to know about SYSCON err log
 
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Leo07 said:
Thanks man and @Rip-flex... I'll follow this... But I've already replaced all the tokin caps... Also where can i get tantalizer (if my project is alive by any chance)... once i get to know about SYSCON err log
Click to expand...
In my signiture I have links to many usfull hihglights from this thread, including the Tantalizers, SYSCON tutorial, and other posts that make it so you don't have to read this 250+ page tread.

If you are on a phone perhaps you can't see signitures. Turn on desktop site to see it. It will appear beneath every post I've made saying "Read This"
 
thanks
RIP-Felix said:
In my signiture I have links to many usfull hihglights from this thread, including the Tantalizers, SYSCON tutorial, and other posts that make it so you don't have to read this 250+ page tread.

If you are on a phone perhaps you can't see signitures. Turn on desktop site to see it. It will appear beneath every post I've made saying "Read This"
Click to expand...
Thanks
 
Leo07 said:
Thanks man and @Rip-flex... I'll follow this... But I've already replaced all the tokin caps... Also where can i get tantalizer (if my project is alive by any chance)... once i get to know about SYSCON err log
Click to expand...

@Rip-flex is that like IOFlex? Or just Flex like strength, or maybe flex like bendy??


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