PS3 (Research/Experimental) - NEC/TOKIN Capacitors Replacement - YLOD

db260179 said:
I'll upload a picture of what to measure for resistance on the rsx. If that checks out ok, then a possible power source issue on the 12v,5v or 3.3v line.
Click to expand...
I've been making my way through several power sources... most of them seem to check out, as far as what the service manual says and what I read out of the board. The only suspicious ones I've found (so far) are
* IC6022, Pin 1 - should be reading +3.3v, but I get 0. Pin 8 is VIN, and reads 4.3v
* IC6021, Pin 1 - should be reading +1.5v, but I get 0. Pin 8 is VIN, and that on reads 3.5v

I'm also getting a constant 4.8v out of pin 4 on IC6023, which is marked as POW_FAIL. But I get that even right after I flip the switch on the back, so I'm guessing that's its normal state (and it'll switch to low if there's an actual power fail).
 
Mmm interesting, looks like IC6011 - Southbridge activator SW_PCI might not be activating down the line.

Check all the proceeding ic chips from the schematics voltages - in the syscon shell you can use a command 'powerstate' quickly when powering on to see that says ON

I would look at the voltage readings from the pic i sent on the RSX, anything 0v is bad and the possible cause of power fail down the line.

Everything on this boards is a power sequence logic - check with your finger on the RSX and CELL when powering on and off to see if it gets warm, if the rsx is cold. Check the testpoints around the RSX for voltages anything 0v is not good.

marciolsf said:
I've been making my way through several power sources... most of them seem to check out, as far as what the service manual says and what I read out of the board. The only suspicious ones I've found (so far) are
* IC6022, Pin 1 - should be reading +3.3v, but I get 0. Pin 8 is VIN, and reads 4.3v
* IC6021, Pin 1 - should be reading +1.5v, but I get 0. Pin 8 is VIN, and that on reads 3.5v

I'm also getting a constant 4.8v out of pin 4 on IC6023, which is marked as POW_FAIL. But I get that even right after I flip the switch on the back, so I'm guessing that's its normal state (and it'll switch to low if there's an actual power fail).
Click to expand...
 
db260179 said:
Mmm interesting, looks like IC6011 - Southbridge activator SW_PCI might not be activating down the line.

Check all the proceeding ic chips from the schematics voltages - in the syscon shell you can use a command 'powerstate' quickly when powering on to see that says ON

I would look at the voltage readings from the pic i sent on the RSX, anything 0v is bad and the possible cause of power fail down the line.

Everything on this boards is a power sequence logic - check with your finger on the RSX and CELL when powering on and off to see if it gets warm, if the rsx is cold. Check the testpoints around the RSX for voltages anything 0v is not good.
Click to expand...

Thank you! I'll give that a try.
 
i solder 2 each 6.3 1000uf on each side of the one NEC but in first run causes instant ylod..i think may be the solders is not good..resolder again but causes non instant ylod..whats your idea?
20200618_163637.jpg
 
Latest experiment on my COK-001 board. Using Workz_777 theory to configure the caps.
Isolated with a piece of clear lexan under the bridge.
 

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aminiani said:
i solder 2 each 6.3 1000uf on each side of the one NEC but in first run causes instant ylod..i think may be the solders is not good..resolder again but causes non instant ylod..whats your idea?
View attachment 26323
Click to expand...
Yeah.... It looks like your iron isn't running hot enough, those solder blobs is not what you want. I'd say look up some quality soldering tutorials on youtube. Voultar, Ben Heck, EEVBlog all have detailed guides on how to solder all sorts of things.

Another thing I noticed is that wire bridge you did. Generally speaking, you never want to use bare wire for bridging, it'll introduce lots of noise you don't want. Particularly with your work, it looks like you just used a piece of solder? There have been extensive discussion around here that you want specific thickness of wire, and solder wire will not do the job. Finally, it might be the angle of the picture, but it looks like you're causing a short on a test point? That little dot of solder, under the left side of the loop. You need to make sure your bridge isn't touching anything other than what you're soldering it to.
 
db260179 said:
Mmm interesting, looks like IC6011 - Southbridge activator SW_PCI might not be activating down the line.

Check all the proceeding ic chips from the schematics voltages - in the syscon shell you can use a command 'powerstate' quickly when powering on to see that says ON

I would look at the voltage readings from the pic i sent on the RSX, anything 0v is bad and the possible cause of power fail down the line.

Everything on this boards is a power sequence logic - check with your finger on the RSX and CELL when powering on and off to see if it gets warm, if the rsx is cold. Check the testpoints around the RSX for voltages anything 0v is not good.
Click to expand...
I measured those caps across their own points... got mostly similar readings to yours, so I presume did that correctly! I did get some differences, though, as noted here
aMdAqNb.jpg

The main difference is those two reading at 44ohm, where you had 80 on the bottom one, and 12.5 on the other. The one on the bottom read 113, which is lower than your's 130, but maybe that's at the low end of tolerance? I haven't checked what's on the service manual for them yet. Your layout seems slightly different than mine too, but seems close enough.

I also tested the temperature! I'd never done that before, and it was definitely interesting. During boot, Cell got warm right away, but RSX stayed cold. I have to step out for a bit, but when I get back I'll get my temperature probes and get some more specific numbers (for science!!). It's also curious because according to syscon, my errors are with Cell, not rsx, but then we do have power failures on a few ICs, so maybe that's why rsx isn't warming up (not powering up?).

Just for kicks, yesterday, i tested powered the unit without the bridge wire, and definitely got an rsx power error from syscon (a0093004). So i'm guessing rsx is getting power, since once i put the wire back on, i get 3034.
 
marciolsf said:
I've been making my way through several power sources... most of them seem to check out, as far as what the service manual says and what I read out of the board. The only suspicious ones I've found (so far) are
* IC6022, Pin 1 - should be reading +3.3v, but I get 0. Pin 8 is VIN, and reads 4.3v
* IC6021, Pin 1 - should be reading +1.5v, but I get 0. Pin 8 is VIN, and that on reads 3.5v

I'm also getting a constant 4.8v out of pin 4 on IC6023, which is marked as POW_FAIL. But I get that even right after I flip the switch on the back, so I'm guessing that's its normal state (and it'll switch to low if there's an actual power fail).
Click to expand...

These ICs depends on signal from SYSCON, see Pin 5 of both. They are from backwards games compatibility sector.
 
Could you paste your 'errlog' from the syscon shell - the ps3_uart.py u are using

44ohm is not good, 69+ is a working RSX chip.

marciolsf said:
I measured those caps across their own points... got mostly similar readings to yours, so I presume did that correctly! I did get some differences, though, as noted here
The main difference is those two reading at 44ohm, where you had 80 on the bottom one, and 12.5 on the other. The one on the bottom read 113, which is lower than your's 130, but maybe that's at the low end of tolerance? I haven't checked what's on the service manual for them yet. Your layout seems slightly different than mine too, but seems close enough.

I also tested the temperature! I'd never done that before, and it was definitely interesting. During boot, Cell got warm right away, but RSX stayed cold. I have to step out for a bit, but when I get back I'll get my temperature probes and get some more specific numbers (for science!!). It's also curious because according to syscon, my errors are with Cell, not rsx, but then we do have power failures on a few ICs, so maybe that's why rsx isn't warming up (not powering up?).

Just for kicks, yesterday, i tested powered the unit without the bridge wire, and definitely got an rsx power error from syscon (a0093004). So i'm guessing rsx is getting power, since once i put the wire back on, i get 3034.
Click to expand...
 
db260179 said:
So these errors come from another thread and are correct, if you say you have error A0403034, then thats actually the RSX at fault

POWER ERRORS:
0003001 POW_FAIL
A0093004 RSX_POW_FAIL
A0093003 CELL_POW_FAIL

BE ERRORS:
A0213013 BE_SPI DI/DO ERROR
A0213011 BE_SPI CS ERROR
A0203010 BE_INIT OR BE_POWGOOD OR CLOCK ERRORS

RSX ERRORS:
A0404002 RSX_SPI DI/DO ERROR
A0404411 - ERROR ON RSX SPI? (My problem)

SB ERRORS:
A0302203 SB_SPI DI/DO ERROR
A0313032 SB_CLOCK OR INIT ERROR

OTHERS:
A0022110 MK I2C ERROR (OR OTHER CLOCK's ERRORS)

upd.
A0403034 and A0404411 - RSX PROBLEMS ( I replaced the RSX)
new my problem: A0603040 - maybe SS2 Bady or NAND error.

So if you have a uart connection to the syscon then you can run some external or internal commands.

My suggestion is run the command 'errlog' in internal mode, and paste it here, its basically a history of all your faults that your board has reported - time stamps might be weird, but usually the last error is the most recent.

What is suspect is wrong with your RSX chip could be - faulty ram chips

I'll upload a picture of what to measure for resistance on the rsx. If that checks out ok, then a possible power source issue on the 12v,5v or 3.3v line.

https://imgur.com/a/IyYDSb4

Anything lower than these values means a bad rsx chip.

Other diagnoses would involve voltage tests on the tests points.

QUOTE="marciolsf, post: 247220, member: 53484"]Thank you for the suggestion on checking resistance values on step 3! A few people here have tested the pads for resistance values, trying to figure out why we appear to have a short, but we haven't had reference values yet, so this is great.

I'm going to check those values on my board and see where I get. I've been reading the syscon for errors, and the code I get (A0403034) indicates BE Error, so I'm guessing it'll be reading .2ohms there.
Click to expand...
[/QUOTE]

Hi can you post a tutorial or link on how to UART into a ps3 and which hardware to use
Thanks
Really interesting
 
db260179 said:
To make the moderators happy and stop polluting this thread I will create a new thread and upload my syscon tutorial!
[QUOTE

Hi can you post a tutorial or link on how to UART into a ps3 and which hardware to use
Thanks
Really interesting/QUOTE]
Click to expand...
Thanks mate, awesome
this is a break through in diagnosing ps3 problems
 
db260179 said:
Could you paste your 'errlog' from the syscon shell - the ps3_uart.py u are using

44ohm is not good, 69+ is a working RSX chip.
Click to expand...
Here's the log, and a few other things I got out of it

> errlog
errlog
ofst[ 80]:err_code:0xffffffff, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 84]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 88]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 92]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 96]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[100]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[104]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[108]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[112]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[116]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[120]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[124]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 0]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 4]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 8]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 12]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 16]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 20]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 24]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 28]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 32]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 36]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 40]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 44]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 48]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 52]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 56]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 60]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 64]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 68]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 72]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff
ofst[ 76]:err_code:0xa0403034, clock:0xffffffff

> bestat
bestat
(Error State) (Unknown Error)

> powerstate
powerstate
ATA Power : OFF
PCI Power : OFF
RSX Power : OFF
XDR Power : OFF
Eurus Power : OFF
SB Power : OFF
RSX Thermal Sensor : UNAVAILABLE
BE Thermal Sensor : UNAVAILABLE

> disp_err
disp_err
CheckStop: None
PLLUnlock: 0
RSX Int: None
PowerSeq: 00
 
Hiya All, success!! ...with Tantalums + MLCCs combination, only on bridge wire.

This is my original PS3 from before, i took off the "new" NEC/Tokins and tested this, and the PS3 works great.

Each NEC was replaced with the following:
- 4 x 470uF - 2.5V (Size B) Tantalums
- 4 x MLCC array:- 1 x 10uF, 1 x 1uF, 1 x 0.1uF, 1 x 0.01uF

The larger MLCCs are X7Rs, and the smaller ones are C0G/NP0 type.

The photo below shows the stage just before i soldered them to the PS3, some Kapton tape was used.

(There are 8 of these, 4 on each side of the board)
Tans_with_MLCCs_1.JPG


...and here below is the PS3 working, and i have tested it many times since, and it works great so far.

Tans_with_MLCCs_2.JPG

EDIT:- please forgive the 3 x reversed tantalums on the RSX i was absent minded when i did those ones lol. I will aim to fix that soon and add an extra 1 x 22uF MLCC to each array (like the NEC datasheet shows - see link below) and report back the results, all being well.

https://web.archive.org/web/2007121...-tokin.com/product/cap/proadlizer/test03.html
 
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Workz_777 said:
Hiya All, success!! ...with Tantalums + MLCCs combination, only on bridge wire.

This is my original PS3 from before, i took off the "new" NEC/Tokins and tested this, and the PS3 works great.

Each NEC was replaced with the following:
- 4 x 470uF - 2.5V (Size B) Tantalums
- 4 x MLCC array:- 1 x 10uF, 1 x 1uF, 1 x 0.1uF, 1 x 0.01uF

The larger MLCCs are X7Rs, and the smaller ones are C0G/NP0 type :)

The photo below shows the stage just before i soldered them to the PS3, some Kapton tape was used :)

(There are 8 of these, 4 on each side of the board)
View attachment 26331

...and here below is the PS3 working, and i have tested it many times since, and it works great so far.

View attachment 26332
Click to expand...

Great! Congratulations!

But there is one tantalum inverted on RSX side
 
Workz_777 said:
Hiya All, success!! ...with Tantalums + MLCCs combination, only on bridge wire.

This is my original PS3 from before, i took off the "new" NEC/Tokins and tested this, and the PS3 works great.

Each NEC was replaced with the following:
- 4 x 470uF - 2.5V (Size B) Tantalums
- 4 x MLCC array:- 1 x 10uF, 1 x 1uF, 1 x 0.1uF, 1 x 0.01uF

The larger MLCCs are X7Rs, and the smaller ones are C0G/NP0 type :)

The photo below shows the stage just before i soldered them to the PS3, some Kapton tape was used :)

(There are 8 of these, 4 on each side of the board)
View attachment 26331

...and here below is the PS3 working, and i have tested it many times since, and it works great so far.

View attachment 26332
Click to expand...
That looks nice and tidy! Do you have a scope so we can take a look at what the new signal looks like?
 
LSL said:
Great! Congratulations!

But there is one tantalum inverted on RSX side
Click to expand...
Looking closely, it looks like it's actually one pointing the right way, and the others pointing the wrong way... Which is fascinating in its own way, since it all works still. I guess it goes back to the old question of "how much capacitance do we really need?"
 
LSL said:
Great! Congratulations!

But there is one tantalum inverted on RSX side
Click to expand...

Oh fudge!!, well spotted bro, arrrrrrrr! ....oh man, i can't believe i didn't see that! :crybaby:

...darn it, i have to take everything apart again. :oops:

But thanks so much for spotting that, it's really appreciated. On a side note, i saw Sony had reversed the polarity on some of the Tantalums they had put in, and they put some of them in "series" see here in the photo below.

See the zone where the power rail feeds the Tantalums, all that is positive (+) and the ground (-) is only on the outside of that zone, and yet we see Sony put the two middle Tantalums (seen in the photo) in "series" and reversed polarity, those 2 middle tantalums don't touch any (-) ground at all...

Poles-reversed.jpg
 
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